tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post636000556284532163..comments2023-12-15T02:04:08.213-08:00Comments on meat: pastured eggs, full employment and illegal rainwaterBruce Kinghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10995706761794063165noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-9466967157194258392012-12-02T20:19:40.732-08:002012-12-02T20:19:40.732-08:00First, we ONLY feed certified organic grain. When ...First, we ONLY feed certified organic grain. When we were selling eggs which was about 4 years ago we were $5/doz. $3-$3.5 of that was feed and labor the rest infrastructure. We also bought grain direct from farmers and ground it ourselves. We had 200 laying hens. Now, we don't have a way to grind our feed at this point. But we still buy direct from tge farmer. We pay around $.20/lb. If we were to buy ground and mixed certified organic feed it would cost $1000/ton. Labor wise, we pay ourselves $10-$20/hr. We've gotta make a living beyond caring for the animals. We don't produce eggs to sell at this point. My hens currently free range and shmooze grain from the hogs. So its a little hard to account for their feed cost. <br /><br />But I have a few observations from our experience. Chicks you hatch and raise yourself have better vitality and much less mortality. EXPECT to lose 10% of your shipped chicks. I believe strongly that chicks do much better with propane brooding because light 24/7 messes with sleep patterns and mental health. It's extraordinarily difficult to transition grown chickens into your system and expect them to produce the same as they did before. Really, that goes for any animal. Animals you buy are not your foundation their offspring are, generally the second generation is your foundation. We bought two cows out of Wisconsin, I can't expect them to produce the same here in SE KS. Completely different climate and forage. We would do better to buy animals that are from similar or hotter climates with similar forage. While they will aclimate, they won't do as well.<br /><br />Anyway, off topic slightly. We are talking about chickens.<br /><br />Cathy, that's pretty awesome with the hatchlings. I tried doing that but I didn't have pure stock so a hard sell. We are trying to hatch our meat birds: duck, chicken and goose. Then we pay ourselves for the hatchlings rather than a hatchery.<br />off grid mamahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03391389670135173476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-57275342682932532272012-12-02T18:48:27.063-08:002012-12-02T18:48:27.063-08:00I'm going to be breeding my own layers, so bey...I'm going to be breeding my own layers, so beyond the breeding stock (which are 6 weeks right now) I won't have much tied up in chick costs. <br /><br />I thought feed here in MN was high compared to MO, but it's only $720/ton for starter (in retail 50# bags) and can be had cheaper. <br /><br />I still don't know what all my costs will be, but I'm hoping to be able to sell eggs for $3.50-4.00/dz without losing my shirt. Andrewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15946612610185670239noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-80069129668806760692012-12-02T18:47:24.598-08:002012-12-02T18:47:24.598-08:00I'm going to be breeding my own layers, so bey...I'm going to be breeding my own layers, so beyond the breeding stock (which are 6 weeks right now) I won't have much tied up in chick costs. <br /><br />I thought feed here in MN was high compared to MO, but it's only $720/ton for starter (in retail 50# bags) and can be had cheaper. <br /><br />I still don't know what all my costs will be, but I'm hoping to be able to sell eggs for $3.50-4.00/dz without losing my shirt. Andrewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15946612610185670239noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-38318621028754038012012-12-02T08:41:43.380-08:002012-12-02T08:41:43.380-08:00I sell more hatchlings than eggs. I always have a...I sell more hatchlings than eggs. I always have a variety of poultry in the incubator and can usually provide what local homesteaders/hobby farmers what they want within a couple of weeks. At five to 10 dollars each I cover most of my feed costs. What I don't sell provides us with a lot of good meals in the fall and winter. <br /><br />I sell one year old layers in the early summer for $12.00 and can't meet the demand. I like to thin in the summer to make room for pullets that will begin laying in the fall. If I don't I have a lot of hens that molt and quit laying for months. <br /><br />I think if I only sold eggs I would never get the true value back. I sell eggs just to manage the surplus and consider our eggs primarily for family use. <br /><br />I enjoyed seeing your numbers and wonder what the potential buyer thought about them.Cathyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14786327481214450958noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-75828984271077243132012-12-02T02:29:20.760-08:002012-12-02T02:29:20.760-08:00Off grid -- what are you paying for feed, and how ...Off grid -- what are you paying for feed, and how many eggs are you producing? <br /><br />Lots of folks sell a few dozen eggs a week, byproduct of their own household egg production, and that's a great way to earn a few bucks, but if you have to pay someone the numbers get big quickly. <br /><br />What a lot of folks figure out when they do the math is that they're paying themselves $3 an hour or less. Bruce Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10995706761794063165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-80738140959182492052012-12-02T00:28:57.467-08:002012-12-02T00:28:57.467-08:00We sell eggs for $5/doz. Well that was before grai...We sell eggs for $5/doz. Well that was before grain prices went up. In our market it's hard to sell organic eggs. Most don't. They just feed conventional feed. Most are priced $3.50/doz. People are so fickle.<br /><br />I have a hard time taking people seriously who want you to do what this guy wants. I know too many farmers who were shot in the foot. Salitan had his buyer back out on him in the beginning ... for eggs even. <br /><br />You should look into propane brooders. A little more up front cost but pretty awesome. No light bulb breakage. QCSupply has them but they sell them for piglet warmers. The smallest one will brood 150 chicks. Love mine! We're off grid so it makes brooding possible. We also put a temp control on so it will kick it on and off to manage the temp for you. Otherwise Robert Plamondon has excellent plans for an insulated brooding hover. We used those when we used electric lights.<br /><br />As to rainwater... depends on the state and who's taking that states water. California, for example, takes Colorados water. Very illegal to collect rainwater there.off grid mamahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03391389670135173476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-58269427809618205552012-11-30T11:59:48.381-08:002012-11-30T11:59:48.381-08:00Our local eggs go for about 4-6/dozen, but there i...Our local eggs go for about 4-6/dozen, but there is no pasture in Calgary, AB. All hens live in barns, cage-free but there IS no grass for 8 months of the year. I've never seen eggs run 7-8/dozen yet.tatianakhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05050105610443855170noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-42241686416953431632012-11-30T11:38:21.090-08:002012-11-30T11:38:21.090-08:00Bruce,
First off, thanks for this post. This is e...Bruce,<br /><br />First off, thanks for this post. This is exactly the kind of detailed info that got me following your blog in the first place. As my wife said on reading it: "Why would anyone ever go into this business!"<br /><br />For sharing the spreadsheet, Google Docs is probably the easiest way to share. You should be able to upload any OpenOffice or Excel file with little no issues. If there are a lot of functions then SkyDrive/Office.com might be better but I have never used it for sharing so can't say for sure.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14571337888695467779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-56306543024647530082012-11-30T00:43:50.221-08:002012-11-30T00:43:50.221-08:00And that small grains seminar I noted above is bec...And that small grains seminar I noted above is because I think that you could economically raise your own chicken feed in the form of some sort of small grain -- wheat, barley, oats... something like that. We have the right kind of weather for that sort of crop, and as the guy who talked about the seminar pointed out, you can buy a small combine for $6k. <br />Bruce Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10995706761794063165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-81425228201512005642012-11-30T00:41:48.164-08:002012-11-30T00:41:48.164-08:00Garand Gal: There's a couple of costs that I ...Garand Gal: There's a couple of costs that I didn't figure into this whole thing. There's cost for housing the birds. you're going to have to come up with an eggmobile or mobile coop of some sort, and you'll need to have it contain roosts for the birds at night, and either have nest boxes in it, or have a seperate laying area that is inviting to the chickens to lay in; otherwise you'll spend hours on an easter egg hunt every day. <br /><br />The hens sell for $10 at the end of the two year laying cycle; so the total revenue from these 400 hens would be $4,000.00 less retailing costs. And if feed costs go down, or we have better survival, or fewer breakages, there's some chance for a bigger profit margin -- which would be good. <br /><br />With this operating the biggest cost is labor. You see the eggs at the market for cheaper because they are raising 20 to 40 thousand birds with the same amount of labor as I'm raising 400 with. It's a LOT less work to deal with birds in a barn. Feed, water and egg collection are all automated. <br />Bruce Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10995706761794063165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-74195437071545215812012-11-30T00:37:04.619-08:002012-11-30T00:37:04.619-08:00Eightway -- i do have spreadsheet, actually. I w...Eightway -- i do have spreadsheet, actually. I wonder how I can post it in a way you could download it? I've never done that. <br /><br />Regarding recycling the hens, see belowBruce Kinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10995706761794063165noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-64953738908840731312012-11-30T00:27:31.741-08:002012-11-30T00:27:31.741-08:00I wanted to ask why you didn't factor in the p...I wanted to ask why you didn't factor in the profit from selling/using the older hens, or the cost of disposing them if that's the way it's going to go.<br /> <br />In our area colored farm eggs go for a premium, in the $7-8 range. White farm eggs go for around $4-5 but the people I see selling them go around to the places that have small flocks, buy up their eggs and package them for resale. We used to have a monastery nearby that raised chickens and sold the eggs on a large scale but they got out of chickens when they were highly criticized for their husbandry practices, even though they kept the animals to a higher standard than required. <br />Garand Galhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09249441887465858969noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1842136564899097734.post-79243302274328644252012-11-30T00:08:58.813-08:002012-11-30T00:08:58.813-08:00Bruce,
There's obviously a spreadsheet behind...Bruce,<br /><br />There's obviously a spreadsheet behind all this text. It would be interesting to see it in that form to play with the assumptions here. <br /><br />Given your numbers it's absolutely astounding that you can buy a dozen factory farmed eggs for so little. Your cost assumptions with zero labor cost yields $2.38 a doz.<br /><br />Also the hens when done have some value as protein/soup/dog/cat food. Not sure what that # is.<br /><br />fwiw, $8 or so is the typical farmstand price for a dozen organic eggs here on vashon.Eightwayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05578189394559089323noreply@blogger.com